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If the shippers were forced to pay detention for the truck sitting there, then this would be a good deal, but all this will be is a financial burden upon the trucking companies themselves.
Furthermore there will be drivers that will figure out how to take advantage of this in one way or another.
Whether it’s a mandate or not, whether it’s minimum wage or not, drivers need to be reimbursed. If this were the case, shippers would have a big incentive for speeding up their operations, and everyone would benefit.
Here I am now. Appointment at Pepsi at 1pm. Got here on the dot. It is now 3:54pm and still waiting at the dock. First 2hrs are free. My driving hours just ticking away. This is one of the many things that needs to be fixed.
I just know they need to do something.
Hey I am a SMALL carrier and why should I have to pay ??? Why shouldn’t the Shippers or receivers pay us to pay the drivers ??? They are the ones causing detention and costing money. Why should Carriers pay for something they did not cause. I barely make it by as it is and having to pay a driver for detention when it should be the shipper or receiver the one causing the problem. I mean I never said hey hold my driver on the dock just for shits and giggle? The BIG companies can afford to pay their drivers this is just a way of driving smaller carriers like me and other small carriers out of business. Doesn’t anyone see this ?? Driver do need to be reimbursed, I need to be reimbursed by these A hole shippers and receiver’s that get away with thievery. But with their lobbyists and friends in high places they seem to get by with anything and carriers owner operators and drivers pay the price. The LAWS should apply to them again the cause of the problems. Doesn’t anyone else get it ?????
Yes ,drivers should be paid and it should be completely on the SHIPPERS AND RECEIVERS,and not the trucking companies.
If the Carrier pays, the shippers will only get worse, No skin off their nose.
I mean just to be clear here and from the comments made where do you get them mandating Shippers to pay ?? It says CARRIERS pay READ …. it DOES say CARRIERS pay not the SHIPPERS or RECIEVERS ????? They are not mandating anyone shippers or receivers to be under these rules just the CARRIERS ???? Like I said as a carrier I never said please Mr. Shipper just for giggles lets keep my driver sitting on the dock costing me and the driver money with out reimbursement. With the brokers in this business we get raped bad enough with out a reach around or even a kiss. Come on make the people that cause these problems pay up Carriers are not the cause of the problem …..
I was both a company owner and a company driver over the years, and as an owner I always billed for layover pay or detention pay, when it was for a driver who worked for me they were compensated. The compensation was always contingent on being able to collect it from the shipper or the receiver.
I agree. It needs to be the SHIPPER and RECEIVER that pay not the trucking company. By the way still at Pepsi. It is now 5:16 and I have less than 4hrs to drive. I am not going to make my 11am appointment for tomorrow two states away.
I think the government needs to stay out of our business. We dont need any more “mandates” or government regulations. We should be able to work this out between the Shippers, Receivers and Carriers without Big Brother telling us what to do.
Detention pay is not the solution. If a driver is held up and paid detention, it does not help his schedule for that day or the rest of the week. Yes, he made a little extra money for a lot of time he lost but his pay the rest of the week will be adjusted because of this time. He will not be able to make the other trips he planned because he was delayed on this one. Maybe this plan would work — shippers have one hour from the time the truck ARRIVES to load and release. When the hour is up, the truck leaves. The truck is paid the full amount for the trip whether it is fully loaded, partially loaded or not loaded at all.
Not if I have to go through what I have to go through now to get it. Isn’t worth it. Hold back a payable BOL, e.g. $2000+, for say $50-$100 until whoever approves it (on the broker and/or shipper side). I’ll take the pay now, they can take the delivery later if they run me out of hours. If it was “mandated” on the shippers side, payable at the time the BOL was presented for payment then duh, yes. Otherwise forget it. FMCSA should be bit more focused on some of the more REAL issues out there such as CSA Data collection flaws than monkeying around with yet something else they don’t understand.
I totally agree with gearjamn. I can’t vote yes or no because 1 it should not be the carriers responsibility to pay for detention. Number 2, anything less than 50 dollars per hour even after the first 2 hours is pure insult and absolutely NO incentive to the shipper/receiver to get their asses moving. Between the driver’s lost mileage pay that could have been made, (mind you even at 10 bucks an hour or whatever minimum wage is these days, that equates to only 20 cents per mile! Face it guys the average is 50 mph) plus the lost revenue for the carrier, even 50 bucks an hour beginning at the 2 hour mark just isn’t enough. Perhaps a sliding scale? 25 bucks being owed at the end of hour 2, another 50 at 3 hours, up to 75 dollars at 4 and continuing on adding another 25 dollars to the pot each hour, with the driver receiving their mileage pay based on 50 miles per hour that could have been driven. Obviously this has to be paid by the carrier/employer of the driver, but if the shipper/receiver’s were having to pay the carrier then no big deal…. There is so much more that could be added to a law like this, like fines and a fair percentage paid to the driver beginning at 5 hours ( can’t let the carriers get rich off detention pay and not give a little extra to the driver for having to set there ya know! Hahaha) forcing the shipper/receivers to provide parking for drivers that have been detained for 4 hours or more, paid taxi so the driver can go get a meal after 4 hours. I don’t know about some of you, but I’m not willing to drop MY money into over priced vending machines when I’ve been stuck in a dock, or waiting for a dock, and I’m the one who arrived on time. THAT would be a good START.
I agree with that as well, but apparently you get your way with greedy, unionized, lazy shippers and receivers? Don’t take me wrong, I wish that could be the way to handle things, but talk is cheap and people don’t give a s***. People unfortunately have to be forced to do things right.
Like Obama care, if this is what it takes to get the ball rolling, so be it. Some carriers dont want to do this so as not to piss of their customers, but it is ok to piss off the drivers. WRONG. Eventually they will learn and start to charge back the shippers, or haul for somebody who will.
Last I heard, the DOT didn’t give a rats patoot about detention, until it was made clear to them that detention = fatigued drivers = accidents. THAT got their attention, and they are considering charging SHIPPERS and RECEIVERS as much as $1,000/hour after the first hour to motivate them to get our trucks off the dock instead of using us as cheap, temporary storage to make up for their poor planning. It’s not that companies ‘can’t’ do it, just that they haven’t been ‘properly motivated’! Works for me.
Co OTR Drivers need to be paid a variable salary based on hrs at work not miles driven. The minimum hourly rate to be used in figuring this salary should by law start with the federal minimum wage.
7.25hr X 24hrs = $174.00 a day. $174.00 / 14hrs = $12.43hr.
Look at it this way:
70hrs in 8 days = an average of 8.75 hours a day.
8.75hrs X 7days = 61.25 average working hours in a week.
$174.00 X 7days = $1,218.00.
$1,218.00 / 61.25hrs = $19.89 an hour.
The cheap labor rate dictated by the ATA companies ( .25 cents a mile ) allows for cheap freight rates. If all carriers were required to pay their Drivers based on a federal wage standard then it stands to reason that freight rates would increase to cover labor cost.
Doesn’t anyone realize that it is the consumer who ultimately pays for any increase?
Until the Co Drivers wake up and admit to themselves that they are at work the entire time they are stationed to the truck following the direction of the carriers WE WILL ALL be held hostage to the ATA companies self imposed labor rate for Drivers.
$1,218.00 / 3,000 miles = .406 cents per mile! Are all Drivers guaranteed 3,000 miles a week at a minimum of .406cpm?
$174.00 a day X 300days = $52,200.00. This is at least what the beginners should be starting at!
Pat Hockaday firstname.lastname@example.org
mabey drivers can be paid at that low rate, but carriers need to be paid at least 50.00 an hour for fuel and tying up their trucks.
are you joking,shipper’s don’t care about us if your late they charge you 200.00 if your early or on time they sit u out in the parking lot and call u 3 hours later,and never pay detention.
As long as the ATA and special interest groups are pushing for new rules and regs, they want all Drivers to think as you do.
As long as we Drivers ignore the issues with lame excuses WE will have to deal with what THEY want to put in place.
OUR BUSINESS is the business of all US citizens and it is up to us to help educate the citizens of the unnecessary rules and regs being forced on us under the guise of safety.
Safety comes at a price that only we drivers seem to be paying.
Funny how the same truckers who complain about too much government in trucking, want the government to step in on this issue. Hypocrisy, at its finest.
Im sure I can say and many have the same issue, we waste at least one complete driving shift waiting for the Shipper or Reciever….at a minimum…
So guys, how do we get this changed from the carrier to the shipper/receiver? This kind of deal will have to come directly from Washington and the industry’s lobby is not going to let this happen to them. The trucking industry does not have enough pull in Washington to get this done. Any ideas?
Well im not sure this is a final solution, but there are a very small number of places I will NOT deliver to because of the way they treat truckers. The only exception is loads that pay really good, for example grocery DC’s. F**k groceries, there the slowest, biggest dickheads in the industry. They charge lumpers money for the right to rip off their customers in every way imaginable, and there SLOW and stupid to boot. Fred Myer, and Safeway being the worst iv seen, in that order. One time I arrived at Fred Myer litteraly 9 min early, and they told me to turn around in there yard, go back out on the street and find a place to turn around and get back in line. Theu tjen took 5 hours to unload the truck, so I will never ever ever do business with Fred Myer again. F**k them!
Any company I ever drove for or was contracted to collected detention pay. Problem was, most of them kept the biggest share of it, if not all of it.
Yvonne, I would suggest you talk to some of the old timers from before Deregulation took hold in the 70’s.
now your talking…in fact the possesery lien concept needs to be enhanced. If a shipper or receiver gives any crap…..cut their credit off and demand payment immediatly.
If a shipper or receiver makes an appt………and than misses their appt….take the load away and charge re-delivery or detention. Screw them.
wow…i got a job for you…. 1.your worth more than min wage 2.the truck is worth about 75$ an hour including driver. 3.The consumer wont buy the product if its to expensive because the shipper mnfgr cant operate efficently. TOO DAM BAD!!! Let the consumer buy it from somone else.
Trinity Logisitcs loves to pay $25 per hour on all detention. that to me is a joke. there needs to be a set reasonable rate
Don’t get off track. It’s about detention time, and getting paid for it. Your gonna be held up regardless if you have other drops or not. It’s about getting paid for the the time you stop, which is your time. I’m out here for a living not to wait hours to unload or give the company my time for their bad planning or the shipper/receiver being behind. When we go to work we should be paid for the time we work out of out 14hr day (13.5) but who’s counting.
Charge you customers for it.
I have to agree with you gearjamn. I’m an O/O and many time I get to the shippers or the receivers and have to wait many hours without pay. I support that there should be a mandate for them to pay not my company. I use to haul a reefer and many times I would arrive on time for my appointment and be told to sit outside until they were ready for me. I always gave them 15 minutes past my time and then would go back to advise them that since I am not a storage facility and that I was here on time for my appointment I would be shutting down my unit. I would also advise them that I am no longer responsible for the product on my trailer. Didn’t take long and I would be at the dock.
If we are held to a minimum wage for detention than we are no ware. It should be based on what driver could have made if he was driving. With a minimum on pay per miles. Then It should also start at the beginning of arrival time if over the 2 hrs we give them. If they can’t get it done in what we already given shippers and receivers than they should be penalized. For example if you arrive on time and they can do there job in that allotted time a day hold you for 2 hrs and 15 minutes then you get paid for that 2 hrs and 15 minutes. It is so easy for shippers and receivers to charge for us being late . But they usually have no facilities to accommodate us when we show up early. A one sided program.
As I have noticed a lot of small towns have put in Industrial Parks and not taken in the fact of needing truck parking. This should be a mandatory for Everything on each who has truck traffic.
i would not support a mandated detention pay unless shippers and receivers paid us from the time the truck arrived until it left. Drivers would be happy with this but the majority do not understand how hard it is already to even get detention pay from shippers/receivers now. The industry has increased rates across the board so heavy already just to keep up with emissions, fuel, parts, labor, etc….. We all are paying at the stores for this already if you have not paid attention…..We need shipper and receivers to just do their job and start getting trucks in and out within a 2 hour window and stop with the games. Government wants carriers to keep paying for everything and says they can not do anything against shipper and receivers……BULL CRAP……I am an ex-driver, I am not against you guys but the buck and time need to roll against shippers and receivers……..
Shipper/receivers need to be held accountable and pay any carrier $100 for the first hour after a 2 hour grace from appointment time then $75 per hour there after until load is completed and bols are in hand.
Explain to me how drivers can counter the huge lobbying efforts and money influence of the ATA and shippers and receivers to keep things as they are and drivers working for free without getting the force of law behind it.
This is not something the government needs to stick their nose in. This is a free market problem.
Driver’s need to be paid detention and the shipper’s and/or consignee’s should be responsible for that. As a broker I do pay detention to drivers provided I am told when they have been there for 2 hrs so I can update my customer. I bill my customer for that time and it is up to them on whether they bill their customer. We also have a trucking division and I will not accept brokered loads especially pipe or bldg materials if detention is not agreed upon.
Todays Co OTR Driver is paid a variable salary based on computer generated miles. ALL TIME SPENT AT WORK is paid for by the number of dispatched miles for the week. Time IS Relevant!
.25cpm X 3000 miles = $750.00
That is $468.00 a week less than the $1,218.00 a week that $7.25 an hr flat for 168 hrs AT WORK would pay.
.25cpm is a beginning rate for truck school grads.
.25cpm X 120,000 miles = $30,000.00 a year income. That is $22,200.00 a year less than what I propose a beginning Driver should be paid.
My method of establishing a variable salary based on hours instead of miles would raise the average income of Drivers from $38,000.00 annually to at least $52,200.00 annually. Thats an average of 27% increase in Drivers wages.
$75.00hr X 24hrs X 300 days = $540,000.00. I would bet that very few trucks gross $540,000.00 a year.
OOIDA has said that the average annual income of an OO is $50,000.00. $50,000.00 / 300 days / 24hrs = $6.95 an hr. That is .30 cents an hour less than the Federal Minimum Wage.
All Drivers need to look at the overall picture before they sell themselves short by only agreeing to detention pay at the shippers and receivers. Companies will detain Drivers for hours or even days for any number of reasons!
Pat Hockaday email@example.com
only if the shipper/receiver pay for it.. why should the trucking company pay detention time for someone else inability to do their job
The company I work for Marten Transport out of Mondovi WI pays us detention at a $20 an hour rate…after 2 hours. AUTOMATICALLY
As long as you’re on time for the pick up or delivery appointment any thing after 2 hours is automatic detention. As of June 1 2014 that drops to ONE hour. I don’t think there’s any other company that can match that!
because the trucking company charges the shippers or receivers. If they don’t pay the detention to the trucking company the trucking company doesn’t do business with them anymore. It’s a
pretty basic concept.
Another misconception I am seeing is drivers seem to think the companies are always paid detention from what I have read. I can tell you I seldom get detention, especially on brokered loads. They always find a way not to pay it to you they are cheap ass bastards. And you can not just get them to pay by billing them. They usually just laugh or hold up your pay dragging it out for months, after all they have the purse strings and the power not you….not to mention you already delivered the product you no longer have any power over them after that…..Its not like I can put them in an arm lock or thump them upside the head as much as I would like too, and make them pay. It just does not work that way. The best way is to work it into the contract with the broker or shipper before you take the load. Then you have some recourse but many times they will not agree to it then what will you haul if no one agrees you have to pay bills so?? That’s why many of us take loads we take the best we can and we usually take it in the rear because as single entity we have no power but as a group or a whole we can change these laws to the correct way they should be but then seems no one can seem to overlook differences for the common good and make changes
Prepaid should be paid by the shipper, collect should be paid by the consignee. Carriers are not in control of detention time, but when the shipper or consignee has to pay the detention time they will be more attentive to how long the detain the driver. but the driver should receive all moneys paid for detention since he/she is the one that has to sit there on the clock.
Why should carriers have to give any time for loading? Name me a profession besides transportation that gives you any free time? Should be mandatory 100.00 per hour and see how fast they can load and unload you.
This Administration seems to stick it’s Nose in everything except what it should be sticking it’s Nose in.
That’s only because the DOT will make money on it no one else
You are going to be adding that when you right up your bills you have a time in time out figure from there. Broker pays you broker bill’s the shipper. Shipper bill receiver. And they will Bitch! There no reason to delay a truck 8 hour just on a straight pull. That makes it to ware you and your driver gets payed like the truck detention is $67.00 a hour and driver is $7.00 why would you have problem with that.
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